When your business feels heavy and overwhelming, sometimes the answer isn't working harder — it's simplifying. In this Hot Seat Coaching session, Lori Lyons sits down with Jennie Hays of Beyond Mindset Coaching to uncover what's really keeping her business from growing.
Jennie blends the emerging modality of brain spotting with practical business coaching to help entrepreneurs move past procrastination, perfectionism, and self-doubt. But as Lori highlights, the real challenge isn't the method – it's the message. Together, they unpack how to focus on symptoms, streamline a website, and build trust with the right clients.
You'll hear a candid conversation about money pressures, networking challenges, and how to reframe your business messaging so that potential clients instantly recognize themselves in your story.
If you've ever struggled with imposter syndrome or felt like your website was doing “too much,” this episode will help you rewire both your mindset and your marketing.
Takeaways:
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Why symptoms resonate more than modalities when attracting clients
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How to simplify your website for clarity and conversions
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The dangers of too many freebies and too much copy
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The power of a strong story and personal presence
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Reframing procrastination and perfectionism as solvable problems
Ready for your own hot seat? Apply at MyCoachLori.com.
Listen now and start turning your clients' words into your business's most persuasive marketing tool.
Let's turn clarity into clients – schedule your Profitable Path Blueprint Call today.
Check out this episode!
00:00:02 Lori Lyons
All right.
00:00:06 Lori Lyons
Hello there, and welcome to our episode today of Hot Seat Coaching with Midlife Business Academy.
00:00:13 Lori Lyons
I'm Lori Lyons, and I am so excited to dive right in with our special victim, I mean, our guest today, Jenny Hayes of Beyond Mindset with Jenny Hayes Coaching.
00:00:24 Lori Lyons
So Jenny, welcome.
00:00:27 Jennie Hays
Thank you so much.
00:00:27 Jennie Hays
It's just a pleasure to be here.
00:00:30 Jennie Hays
I'm looking forward to this.
00:00:32 Lori Lyons
Well, good, good.
00:00:33 Lori Lyons
I've got some really cool things for you and I can't wait to dive right in.
00:00:37 Lori Lyons
So we're just going to, we're just going to jump in with both feet.
00:00:41 Lori Lyons
So for the first question, let's kind of set the stage here.
00:00:45 Lori Lyons
Let's think about what your business is going to look like in six months.
00:00:49 Lori Lyons
So if you want to close your eyes and picture it, what do you see in six months?
00:00:55 Jennie Hays
So in six months, I see my client load increasing.
00:01:01 Jennie Hays
I'd like to be around 10 a week.
00:01:04 Jennie Hays
It's a nice number.
00:01:08 Jennie Hays
Planning my next retreat.
00:01:10 Jennie Hays
We just got done with retreat, love it.
00:01:13 Jennie Hays
And really leaning into the outreach and the networking and the client just
00:01:23 Jennie Hays
Getting to talk to new people, which is what I really love.
00:01:26 Lori Lyons
Good, good.
00:01:27 Lori Lyons
So give us in a nutshell what you do now that you've told us where you want the business to go.
00:01:31 Lori Lyons
Tell us what you do.
00:01:33 Jennie Hays
So I do a unique style of it's not really mindset.
00:01:37 Jennie Hays
That's why I call it beyond mindset.
00:01:39 Jennie Hays
It's a technique called brain spotting, where those little landmines, those things that keep us stuck in life.
00:01:47 Jennie Hays
We can go in there and instead of traditional mindset that teaches you to go around the landmine, brain spotting comes in and we scoop it out.
00:01:56 Jennie Hays
And so I combine that now with business coaching, especially for those people that are kind of, they've been wanting to do the thing and they just can't.
00:02:05 Jennie Hays
We go in, we take out a landmine, we get some practical steps, we get some movement forward.
00:02:11 Jennie Hays
Oh my goodness, another landmine.
00:02:12 Jennie Hays
Let's go in and take that out.
00:02:14 Jennie Hays
And it's an amazing combination.
00:02:16 Jennie Hays
And I just see people explode in, in their profitability and their work-life balance and just forward motion in their business.
00:02:26 Lori Lyons
That sounds very cool.
00:02:27 Lori Lyons
Yeah, I did a little research on brain spotting, so I have a little bit of background and it does sound really good.
00:02:33 Lori Lyons
It's kind of a unique modality, a new modality, isn't it?
00:02:37 Jennie Hays
Yes.
00:02:38 Jennie Hays
Yeah, it's relatively new.
00:02:40 Jennie Hays
So David Grand actually created it.
00:02:44 Jennie Hays
He was doing EMDR, which for those who don't know, it's a treatment for severe trauma.
00:02:52 Jennie Hays
And you use the eyes and you wave your hand in front of the eyes and it helps to connect the sides of the brain.
00:02:58 Jennie Hays
But when he was doing it on this ice skater who could not complete a specific jump, it was supposed to be an easy one.
00:03:06 Jennie Hays
He found that her eyes kind of did something weird.
00:03:09 Jennie Hays
He was like, hmm.
00:03:10 Jennie Hays
So the next cycle when he got in front of that spot again, did it again.
00:03:14 Jennie Hays
So he hung out there and she uncovered a new memory.
00:03:18 Jennie Hays
ended up that her dad had come in and said, I don't want to be an ice skating dad anymore.
00:03:23 Jennie Hays
And her little brain said, oh, if I do this jump, someone else is going to abandon me.
00:03:30 Jennie Hays
So they were able to clear it in that session, and she was on the ice later that day and landed the jump.
00:03:36 Lori Lyons
That's awesome.
00:03:37 Lori Lyons
And isn't it amazing how, you know, they say the eyes are the windows to the soul, but it really is the windows to a lot of things because your eyes can really tell a lot about you and where they go and what they do.
00:03:48 Lori Lyons
So with what you do, who is your ideal client?
00:03:53 Jennie Hays
I love the entrepreneur who's like what I was, you know, you know the things, you've done all the coaching, you've paid for everything, you're kind of at the point where it's like,
00:04:03 Jennie Hays
I just don't think I can do this.
00:04:05 Jennie Hays
There's something wrong with me.
00:04:07 Jennie Hays
And really, all we need to do is go in and scoop some of those landmines out, put those pieces together and get you on the road.
00:04:16 Lori Lyons
So what do you see is your biggest obstacle for holding you back from where you see yourself in six months?
00:04:25 Jennie Hays
I would say right now it's change in my family life in the fact that, first of all, I love my husband, but he talked me into the fact that I was not networking with the right people.
00:04:43 Jennie Hays
And so I quit networking.
00:04:45 Jennie Hays
Let me tell you, don't do that.
00:04:49 Jennie Hays
But then on top of that, he had a huge
00:04:53 Jennie Hays
career change.
00:04:54 Jennie Hays
And so I went from being a, okay, what you're making is extra and is nice to, you've got to carry some of the weight of the household.
00:05:07 Jennie Hays
And we carry a lot on our shoulders.
00:05:10 Jennie Hays
We carry a lot in our spirit.
00:05:12 Jennie Hays
And I just kind of went, now I'm not networking and now I'm not making money.
00:05:19 Jennie Hays
So I'm mentally, I know
00:05:22 Jennie Hays
that it's like, okay, I'm back on the road, but it feels almost oppressive.
00:05:29 Lori Lyons
Yeah, like you've got a different pressure now.
00:05:32 Jennie Hays
Right.
00:05:33 Lori Lyons
So describe to me networking.
00:05:35 Lori Lyons
What is your, what do you like to do from a networking standpoint?
00:05:38 Jennie Hays
Talk to people.
00:05:40 Jennie Hays
So I do everything virtually.
00:05:42 Jennie Hays
And I do wrestle with this.
00:05:45 Jennie Hays
So there was a group that I love called Polka Dots, which I would love to join.
00:05:52 Jennie Hays
But it's $300 and right now with the financial situation Every penny that I do make has to go to the household.
00:05:58 Jennie Hays
So I don't have the 300 for that I've been doing a lot of networking on alignable with the smart connects and I've met some good people here and there but it does feel a little overwhelmed.
00:06:11 Jennie Hays
There's a lot of multi-level marketing and a lot of people who are doing heavy pitching and so finding
00:06:20 Jennie Hays
It's like looking for the needle in the haystack.
00:06:22 Jennie Hays
There's needles in there.
00:06:24 Jennie Hays
And so sometimes it can be, it's like, okay, how many people do I want to do the little speed dating thing with this week to try to find one or two people?
00:06:36 Jennie Hays
I'm putting about 10 to 12 hours of networking in to get one client.
00:06:43 Jennie Hays
And so I'm basically running at about 20 bucks an hour.
00:06:49 Jennie Hays
Right.
00:06:50 Jennie Hays
It's expensive.
00:06:51 Lori Lyons
So is this similar to what you were doing prior before you had the pressure of, I've got to make money, I got to make money, I got to make money?
00:06:59 Jennie Hays
It was, but I was coming in with a little bit different angle.
00:07:03 Jennie Hays
So when I first started, all I was doing was just throwing brain spotting out there without the coaching.
00:07:08 Jennie Hays
It was like, because brain spotting can be used for so many different things.
00:07:14 Jennie Hays
And what was happening is I was doing the networking.
00:07:18 Jennie Hays
People were like, oh, well, I don't need you, but this person does and this person does and this person does, which was great, but it made for a very confusing message and made it really hard for me when I would go into other venues to say, okay, this is what I do.
00:07:35 Jennie Hays
And so I've been really trying to, during that downtime, streamline my message into imposter syndrome because it's something that we all deal with.
00:07:44 Lori Lyons
So give me your message.
00:07:46 Lori Lyons
Tell me what you tell people.
00:07:48 Jennie Hays
I'm still working on all of that.
00:07:52 Lori Lyons
Yeah.
00:07:54 Jennie Hays
So I work with entrepreneurs who are stuck.
00:07:57 Jennie Hays
They've gotten all of the training, they've done all the coaching, they know all the stuff.
00:08:01 Jennie Hays
But when it comes to actually pulling the trigger, turning on that video, writing that blog or that post, they can't do it.
00:08:09 Jennie Hays
And I get you unstuck sometimes in as little as one to three hours.
00:08:13 Lori Lyons
Okay.
00:08:15 Lori Lyons
One of the things that when you signed up for the coaching is I have you fill out a little form.
00:08:20 Jennie Hays
I know.
00:08:21 Lori Lyons
And so one of the things I asked is, who is your, who is your dream client?
00:08:26 Lori Lyons
And here's what you said.
00:08:29 Lori Lyons
When you think about your dream client, that really you said that you want to work with brilliant coaches or creatives.
00:08:38 Jennie Hays
Yes.
00:08:38 Lori Lyons
Does that ring a bell?
00:08:40 Jennie Hays
Yeah.
00:08:40 Lori Lyons
So
00:08:41 Lori Lyons
that brilliant coach or creative who second guesses herself and hides when it's time to be visible.
00:08:48 Jennie Hays
I like that verbiage so much better.
00:08:50 Jennie Hays
I was in a good place when I wrote that.
00:08:55 Lori Lyons
And here's what's interesting, and it's very easy for us to do because it's very easy to go into what's comfortable.
00:09:04 Lori Lyons
I know brain spotting, it's kind of different, and I can talk about brain spotting all day long.
00:09:10 Lori Lyons
but nobody really cares about brain spotting.
00:09:13 Jennie Hays
They just want to get the results.
00:09:14 Lori Lyons
Exactly, exactly.
00:09:16 Lori Lyons
So that's the first thing that I see is talk about the problems that you solve, not in just terms of imposter syndrome, because the chances of somebody coming to you and saying, I have imposter syndrome, can you do brain spotting on me?
00:09:31 Lori Lyons
Are probably pretty small.
00:09:34 Lori Lyons
Pretty small, yeah.
00:09:36 Lori Lyons
So what are the symptoms?
00:09:38 Lori Lyons
of imposter syndrome.
00:09:40 Lori Lyons
You kind of alluded to some of them, so what about?
00:09:44 Jennie Hays
The fear of getting on camera, the feeling like you're not enough, the questioning of whether or not you have enough knowledge, skill to do the thing.
00:09:58 Jennie Hays
Always comparing yourself, comparisonitis.
00:10:03 Jennie Hays
You know, just that internal just doubt
00:10:07 Jennie Hays
or procrastination shows up.
00:10:09 Jennie Hays
It shows up as procrastination A lot.
00:10:11 Jennie Hays
I actually spoke to a later day.
00:10:13 Jennie Hays
She was like, what did you do when you looked at your list?
00:10:15 Jennie Hays
Well, I checked my e-mail and I went to the fridge and got some chocolate cake.
00:10:21 Lori Lyons
Sounds good to me.
00:10:24 Lori Lyons
Yeah.
00:10:24 Lori Lyons
I have a client that we were working and she was, she's doing a course and she was doing some YouTube videos and she sent me the video and she said, I'm going to have to redo these.
00:10:33 Lori Lyons
I said, why?
00:10:34 Lori Lyons
She said, because my hair is out of place.
00:10:38 Lori Lyons
Like, what hair?
00:10:40 Lori Lyons
You know, that perfectionism is so, especially in that imposter syndrome.
00:10:46 Lori Lyons
So let's let's re reframe this a little bit.
00:10:50 Lori Lyons
What if you set up and said, I work with because I don't help.
00:10:57 Lori Lyons
I don't like I don't like to say help.
00:10:59 Jennie Hays
I don't like I help.
00:11:00 Jennie Hays
Yeah.
00:11:01 Lori Lyons
I work with business owners who are creative, who are brilliant, but are having a hard time getting started in their businesses because they put things off, they procrastinate, which is the same thing.
00:11:15 Lori Lyons
They struggle with trying to make everything perfect, which means they get nothing done, yada, yada.
00:11:20 Lori Lyons
So symptoms, symptoms, symptoms, system, symptom.
00:11:24 Lori Lyons
I help them get over and start really being productive in their business.
00:11:31 Lori Lyons
You don't talk about how.
00:11:33 Lori Lyons
Nobody cares how to do it.
00:11:36 Jennie Hays
Here's what my instinct, my gut goes, oh, but.
00:11:42 Jennie Hays
But.
00:11:42 Jennie Hays
You know, it's the but.
00:11:43 Jennie Hays
And so the and.
00:11:45 Lori Lyons
So let's play that out.
00:11:47 Lori Lyons
What is your but?
00:11:48 Jennie Hays
My but is how do I make myself stand out amongst all of the others that are doing that?
00:11:54 Jennie Hays
And that's where the but comes in.
00:11:56 Jennie Hays
It's like,
00:11:57 Jennie Hays
Okay, now, what?
00:11:59 Lori Lyons
Yes, so here's where your **** can come in.
00:12:03 Lori Lyons
This is, that sounds really funny, that is.
00:12:08 Lori Lyons
BUT, BUT.
00:12:10 Lori Lyons
So you've talked about, you know, here's the symptoms, here's how I serve.
00:12:15 Lori Lyons
My name is Jenny Hayes.
00:12:18 Lori Lyons
I work with entrepreneurs through a unique and different way of delving into these situations and these problems by one, two, three.
00:12:29 Lori Lyons
Three very simple ways that you help them solve the problem and then that's it.
00:12:35 Lori Lyons
Contact me for a business breakthrough call or whatever the call is or go to my website and we'll talk about the quiz in just a second and take the quiz and find out where you are.
00:12:45 Lori Lyons
Simple, short, sweet, it's not confusing.
00:12:47 Lori Lyons
But it also gives you enough that you can say, this is what makes me different.
00:12:53 Lori Lyons
Different.
00:12:54 Jennie Hays
Yeah.
00:12:55 Lori Lyons
Yes.
00:12:55 Lori Lyons
Because believe me, I'm a marketing person and you can't walk down the street without running into 500 of them.
00:13:01 Lori Lyons
So I totally get it.
00:13:03 Jennie Hays
Yeah.
00:13:04 Jennie Hays
And that's, you know, that's where my imposter syndrome lies.
00:13:08 Lori Lyons
Absolutely.
00:13:09 Jennie Hays
Yeah.
00:13:09 Jennie Hays
And I recognize that.
00:13:11 Lori Lyons
Yes.
00:13:11 Lori Lyons
And sometimes we're not going to we're not going to
00:13:15 Lori Lyons
We're not going to be the right person for everybody.
00:13:17 Jennie Hays
Oh, yeah.
00:13:18 Lori Lyons
How many times have you had somebody come up and say to you, I just feel your energy and I want to work with you.
00:13:23 Lori Lyons
I don't know what you do, but I just know I need you.
00:13:27 Lori Lyons
So if you make it very clear what you do and who you serve in very simple language that they will understand without going into the modality of it, I think you'll see some different results because they'll start thinking, oh, that's me.
00:13:43 Jennie Hays
That's me.
00:13:44 Jennie Hays
Yeah.
00:13:45 Jennie Hays
And I do have a presence, especially on video.
00:13:47 Jennie Hays
And that's something that after my brain spotting, I figured out it was like, I was trying to do all the shoulds.
00:13:53 Jennie Hays
And it was like, no, I need, I know what I need to do.
00:13:57 Jennie Hays
I need to be on video and I need to be doing video conferencing with people.
00:14:01 Jennie Hays
So yeah, if I can get that brain spotting, which is turning into a dirty word for me, you know, out of my mouth.
00:14:11 Lori Lyons
It shouldn't because this is how you're going to grow your business, how you're going to make money.
00:14:15 Lori Lyons
So you don't want it to.
00:14:17 Lori Lyons
That plays out the psyche.
00:14:19 Jennie Hays
Stop saying it.
00:14:20 Jennie Hays
It's like, so I don't know if you looked at, I'm sure you did look at the website because you do your homework.
00:14:26 Jennie Hays
Yeah, you'll see that I don't have brain spotting listed pretty much anywhere.
00:14:31 Jennie Hays
There's a few places.
00:14:32 Lori Lyons
Yes.
00:14:32 Lori Lyons
Yeah.
00:14:33 Lori Lyons
So let's switch gears and jump a little bit into that website because that's one of the things that you want to talk about was your website and your website audit.
00:14:42 Lori Lyons
And within the space of time that we have, I can't do a full one, but I'll give you some overall impressions about what I saw and some things that you can work on.
00:14:53 Lori Lyons
The first thing is there's some things you do really, really well.
00:14:57 Lori Lyons
You really hit the pain points.
00:14:59 Lori Lyons
You really talk to
00:15:01 Lori Lyons
what people's problems are, what your visitors to your site are, so that, you know, almost, and here's a but, but you almost go too much.
00:15:14 Lori Lyons
So the pain points, and well, let me, I'll expand on that in just a little bit, a little bit later.
00:15:20 Lori Lyons
But I love how you talk about, you know, imposter syndrome and imperfection.
00:15:24 Lori Lyons
You, I can see a lot of me in you or the problems that you solve.
00:15:30 Lori Lyons
The quiz,
00:15:31 Lori Lyons
First, there's, I don't know if you know this, but you have two quizzes up.
00:15:35 Lori Lyons
Your pop-up comes up and it's the quiz that says, are you diabetic resistant?
00:15:40 Lori Lyons
And I took that one.
00:15:41 Jennie Hays
I don't know.
00:15:42 Lori Lyons
Yes.
00:15:42 Lori Lyons
And then I couldn't find it.
00:15:43 Lori Lyons
Where did that come from?
00:15:44 Lori Lyons
So just to.
00:15:46 Jennie Hays
Just to make note of that right now, because that should not be the one that's up there.
00:15:51 Lori Lyons
It was very confusing.
00:15:52 Lori Lyons
He's like, I don't see diabetic anywhere.
00:15:56 Lori Lyons
I was like, so that's a niche.
00:15:58 Jennie Hays
Over a year ago.
00:16:00 Lori Lyons
Yeah, so it did still come up.
00:16:02 Lori Lyons
But then I found your business quiz.
00:16:05 Lori Lyons
I'm like, okay, this is really good.
00:16:07 Lori Lyons
There's a lot of really good questions.
00:16:09 Lori Lyons
I took it.
00:16:09 Lori Lyons
I just when I take those, I'll just go through and I'll do the middle and all of them just to see what it is to see what the funnel is.
00:16:16 Lori Lyons
So it's it was very engaging.
00:16:19 Lori Lyons
I felt very low pressure from it.
00:16:21 Lori Lyons
Like, okay, this is this is allowing me to answer the questions and you had a good variety of answers within those within those questions.
00:16:30 Lori Lyons
So I really felt like
00:16:31 Lori Lyons
you were covering a lot of them.
00:16:32 Lori Lyons
And I like the way on the top where you had the different business.
00:16:36 Lori Lyons
So that was intriguing to me that you had the different business types at the top.
00:16:41 Lori Lyons
So, if I really wanted to get creative, I could say, well, I want to be this type of business owner.
00:16:46 Lori Lyons
You could answer the questions.
00:16:49 Lori Lyons
Remember the old, when you took the Cosmo quizzes and answers.
00:16:55 Lori Lyons
Yeah.
00:16:55 Lori Lyons
So, and the other thing that I noticed about that is your voice and your story really came through.
00:17:01 Lori Lyons
So on the homepage where you've got who you are and about your story, that really came through loud and clear.
00:17:07 Lori Lyons
So there's your unique selling point is your story.
00:17:11 Lori Lyons
And a lot of us, a lot of business owners, we don't realize when you said, you know, how am I going to make myself stand out?
00:17:17 Lori Lyons
It's your story that will make you stand out because you've been there, done that, and you've gone through the process.
00:17:23 Lori Lyons
That's what makes you unique.
00:17:25 Lori Lyons
So that will help you there.
00:17:29 Lori Lyons
So you've really got some very strong, good, positive things about the site.
00:17:36 Lori Lyons
The first thing that I saw from a I'd love to see you change thing is there's a lot of text.
00:17:46 Jennie Hays
Yeah, it's very heavy text.
00:17:48 Lori Lyons
It is very heavy text.
00:17:50 Lori Lyons
We have kind of done a shift in the website world where, especially for a coach,
00:17:56 Lori Lyons
You want to give people enough information that they know that they want to talk with you.
00:18:03 Lori Lyons
A website, you don't necessarily need to sell them on the site because you want to do that because you want to be the one to talk them through and point them in the direction of which is the right package that you want them to go to, which is the one that's going to fit with them.
00:18:19 Lori Lyons
And if you've got so much information on there that they're going to choose for you,
00:18:24 Lori Lyons
And either they're going to choose, okay, she didn't have anything that is going to help me, or I don't know, because there was so much over there that it felt like overwhelm.
00:18:35 Jennie Hays
Information overload.
00:18:36 Lori Lyons
Yes.
00:18:37 Lori Lyons
So between all of the different texts and all of the different options that I had, I could take a quiz, I could schedule a call.
00:18:45 Lori Lyons
Oh, here are all of your services.
00:18:47 Lori Lyons
Here's all of this.
00:18:48 Lori Lyons
So where do I go next?
00:18:50 Lori Lyons
So from a visitor
00:18:52 Lori Lyons
engagement standpoint, I'd like to see you pull some of that back and really and really tighten that up as I think you could do that.
00:19:00 Lori Lyons
Do you use AI at all?
00:19:02 Jennie Hays
Oh, constantly.
00:19:03 Jennie Hays
Okay.
00:19:04 Lori Lyons
Okay.
00:19:05 Lori Lyons
Then I will, you know, have ChatGPT or which, what is your, what is your?
00:19:10 Jennie Hays
Chat is my, chat is my friend.
00:19:12 Lori Lyons
Chat is your friend.
00:19:14 Lori Lyons
I totally agree.
00:19:15 Lori Lyons
So if you were to take your website and pull it in and say,
00:19:19 Lori Lyons
Help me tighten this up and give it a prompt to say, here's who I want to work with.
00:19:23 Lori Lyons
Here's my ideal client.
00:19:26 Lori Lyons
I want my copy to speak directly to them, but I want to condense it so that they will see themselves, but I'm not giving them the farm.
00:19:34 Lori Lyons
The goal is to have them call me or take the quiz.
00:19:38 Lori Lyons
Because when you look at a client journey, you're giving them enough information to say, I'm intrigued.
00:19:48 Lori Lyons
I'm intrigued enough to want to know more.
00:19:50 Lori Lyons
So I'll take the quiz knowing that I'll get some more information about you.
00:19:54 Lori Lyons
We'll start building it.
00:19:55 Lori Lyons
We'll start dating a little bit.
00:19:57 Lori Lyons
Or, you know, I kind of like her.
00:19:59 Lori Lyons
I'm going to go ahead and just jump right in and we'll go right into engagement and I'll schedule a call because I see.
00:20:05 Lori Lyons
So those are your two main.
00:20:07 Lori Lyons
Very rarely do you have somebody just go, oh man, I'm going to go for this package because
00:20:15 Lori Lyons
I'm going to send her, you know, a thousand words, call it a day, you know. So you, you know, you want to, you want to, I did an email recently that talked about the trust recession. You know, we've got to work a little harder to build trust nowadays, and I think that will help you. Is that resonating so far? Yes. Okay. All right. Any questions so far?
00:20:42 Jennie Hays
No, because I think I'm seeing that most of the freebies need to go away. The services page, very brief and bare, or how do I, because that's where I've got, I've got all the packages there. Do I still want to let them know that I have these or just?
00:20:58 Lori Lyons
You could still let them know that you have them, these, or you could say, these are the three different ways you can work with me. You can work with me through coaching packages.
00:21:06 Lori Lyons
You can work with me through one-on-one packages, or you can work with me through whatever the other retreat you said you did retreats.
00:21:13 Jennie Hays
Yeah.
00:21:13 Lori Lyons
So those retreats and you can have the three services. They're very high level what they're about. Contact me and let's see if which, which is the right one for you.
00:21:24 Jennie Hays
So just much more high level.
00:21:26 Lori Lyons
Yes. Yes. Because you want to make the decision with them. You don't want them to make the decision for you because
00:21:35 Lori Lyons
What they think is their problem may not be their problem.
00:21:38 Jennie Hays
Generally not.
00:21:40 Lori Lyons
Generally not, especially with what you do, when you can look in and find that. So the other thing that I see is with using your description of brilliant, creative entrepreneurs, I would like to see you highlight that more. This is who I work with, is this you?
00:22:04 Lori Lyons
Are you a brilliant, creative business owner, but just can't seem to get your brilliance out in the world? There's a lot of broken language.
00:22:15 Jennie Hays
Yeah.
00:22:16 Lori Lyons
And that, you know, I had a coach once who said, you know, when you're talking about problems, you find the bruise and then you put your thumb in the middle of it and you just push it. Honey, you push that bruise.
00:22:31 Jennie Hays
I'm going through the other side. That's what you're saying.
00:22:34 Lori Lyons
Yeah. Give me some hope there. Because I think you can still give the message that you have something. We all have something that holds us back.
00:22:47 Jennie Hays
Right.
00:22:47 Lori Lyons
I have a really simple way that can get underneath that and bring out that creative brilliance and help you move forward
00:22:58 Lori Lyons
and sometimes just a matter of hours. Okay, lean in. Tell me more. I'd like to know more about this because you're not telling me I need to have years and years of therapy. You're telling me you might could hone in and do something like this. Schedule a call and let's talk about it and let's find out it or take the quiz and find out.
00:23:19 Jennie Hays
And find out. Yeah. I'm getting a transcript of this, right?
00:23:24 Lori Lyons
Absolutely. Absolutely.
00:23:28 Lori Lyons
So, if you lead with brilliance, then you can always follow up with the broken stuff. But cue them in. Say, yeah, that's me. Also, if you can give them some direction of here's the diet, here's who you are, and here's the path. You can do this very simply, you know, and it's okay to talk about your brain spotting,
00:23:57 Lori Lyons
I don't mind if you talk about that, or at least talk about what the modality can do. You may or may not call it brain spotting, but you can talk about what the modality can do. We can look at, and I don't know the modality well enough to know exactly how you pinpoint the little spots of trauma, but you can talk about it in general terms. And so the things, it's a very simple process, you know, we can put it this way.
00:24:28 Lori Lyons
We talked a little bit about the too many avenues, the too many doors open up.
00:24:33 Jennie Hays
Too many, yeah, things open.
00:24:35 Lori Lyons
Too many things open. I would also talk about, you talk a lot about the transformation, but I would make it very clear, the transformation. Sometimes as creative, brilliant entrepreneurs, we feel stuck.
00:24:55 Lori Lyons
by blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, we can unstick you so that, here's our, you know, our favorite so that statements, so that you can feel comfortable being visible and doing video and putting your message out to the world and, you know, start growing your business and bringing in clients and, you know, whatever those next steps or whatever those benefits are. So if you pull them through the transformation and give them the end result on the end,
00:25:24 Lori Lyons
in your content, then they will see that there is an avenue. They will see that there's a direction for them, not just that you're broken, I can fix it.
00:25:33 Jennie Hays
Okay.
00:25:34 Lori Lyons
You're broken, I can fix it, and here's what the result is in that country.
00:25:40 Jennie Hays
Here's a general idea of how we're doing it and where you'll end up.
00:25:44 Lori Lyons
Yeah. And you can do that in pretty broad strokes without getting real, real specific with that, because again,
00:25:51 Lori Lyons
Your goal is to get them, the end goal is to get them to call you so that you can have a call with them and work with them, ultimately, if you're a right fit to work together. So when you look at it from that, you know, a call is a lot easier to sell on a website than a package. Yeah. So when you pull that into it, I think you'll find that that takes a lot of pressure off of you.
00:26:19 Lori Lyons
for the things that you want your website to do or the calls that you do. Does that make sense?
00:26:25 Jennie Hays
Yeah, and it may be that I was just putting, as you say it that way, it's like, maybe I was just putting too much on the website. I was gonna get too many jobs.
00:26:36 Lori Lyons
Yes.
00:26:36 Jennie Hays
Because, you know, it's got all of the freebies, it's got all of the, it's got a lot. And so maybe it's actually overwhelming because there's so much.
00:26:47 Lori Lyons
Absolutely.
00:26:48 Jennie Hays
Yeah.
00:26:48 Lori Lyons
You don't know what to turn. And you know that old saying, a confused mind doesn't buy. So you'll hop right off and say, all right, I don't know. I'm out. So I'm just going to sit here and dwell on my confusion and my imperfection and my procrastination and my imposter syndrome. The other thing that I saw that I really, really liked
00:27:14 Lori Lyons
on your site was I pulled out one sentence or one phrase on there and it said, what's wired can be rewired. That is a terrific visual and a terrific theme, an overall theme that you could use. We're all wired in a certain way. Let's work on that rewiring.
00:27:39 Jennie Hays
Okay. I wrote that down because I really lean into the, you're not broken, you're blocked.
00:27:46 Lori Lyons
Yes.
00:27:47 Jennie Hays
But that makes a nice married picture.
00:27:50 Lori Lyons
Yes. It says you have a problem.
00:27:54 Jennie Hays
Yeah.
00:27:54 Lori Lyons
But it's a fixable problem because we all know wiring can be fixed.
00:27:59 Jennie Hays
Right.
00:27:59 Lori Lyons
If you tell me I'm broken, I could probably be glued back together.
00:28:08 Lori Lyons
But sure, all we got to do is fix my wiring. That's awesome. And you could even take that word wire and make some kind of a framework with it. Get onto your friend ChatGPT and say, make me a framework around what I do using the word wire, W-I-R-E. Frameworks are huge right now. Everybody has frameworks. To do some kind of, there you've got to talk, you've got to,
00:28:36 Lori Lyons
You know, you've got a theme that you can work in with. I saved the best for last, by the way. How is that all resonate? We've thrown a lot in the last, in the 30 minutes. So how is this resonating with you?
00:28:50 Jennie Hays
I'm internally laughing a little because if I was somebody else's sight, I could see that. And I love that. That's one of the things I love about coaching is that if it was somebody else's, you could see a lot of it.
00:29:03 Jennie Hays
Yet I was completely blind and it makes so much sense. Now the wire and rewire, that was a completely, I hadn't even really grasped onto that and I love that and I will play with.
00:29:15 Lori Lyons
I was on your site several times and I actually found it this morning. I was like, oh, where did that come from? Have you even done this?
00:29:23 Lori Lyons
This, I like it because it just kind of all of a sudden it just jumped. It literally jumped out.
00:29:28 Jennie Hays
Jumped out at you.
00:29:29 Lori Lyons
Yeah. And it was like, okay, let's revise this because I had a whole bunch of other notes, but it was like, okay, let's go around it. So what do you think has been your biggest aha moment or your biggest thing from today?
00:29:44 Jennie Hays
Simplify the website. That is, I mean, that is the biggest thing that and I didn't write down the
00:29:51 Jennie Hays
the rephrasing, so I cannot wait until we get this, I get the recording or the transcript. But yeah, just simplify it. Only ask the website to do so much. Is it going to be everything?
00:30:05 Lori Lyons
Absolutely. I think you'll find from your networking to your website to just how you talk about it in every day, messaging is your problem.
00:30:16 Jennie Hays
Yeah, and I have been aware of that at least.
00:30:18 Lori Lyons
At least I knew that was the issue.
00:30:22 Lori Lyons
Yeah, yeah. Yes, yes. So we'll fine tune it, we'll make some words and some language that will make sense to your ideal client. Because that will, acknowledging that they're creative and brilliant will bring them in. Telling them that they're broken is kind of like, well, that's hard to fix, you know?
00:30:43 Jennie Hays
Yeah.
00:30:43 Lori Lyons
So I think you'll find that messaging will help. And I can't wait to hear how it works. Yeah.
00:30:50 Lori Lyons
Here it works for you. And if we had another 30 minutes, we'd reframe the money and all the kind of good stuff. But we'll work on that.
00:30:59 Jennie Hays
I needed some brain slotting on that.
00:31:01 Lori Lyons
You got it. You got it. So I want to thank you for joining us today. I hope you've gotten some really good ideas. Jenny, thank you for being so coachable and such a great guest today.
00:31:16 Lori Lyons
You can, we'll put Jenny's information if you want to reach out to her and find out more about brain spotting. And although we're talking about how, you know, how you can be rewired, then I'll put your contact information in the show notes. But in the meantime, you know, if you would like to do some hot seat coaching,
00:31:35 Lori Lyons
You can go to– hold on. I got to look at the mycoachlori.com, which will take you right to the scheduler. And you can schedule your own hot seat coaching call. And we'll do this live and in person and on camera. So thank you again. If you're watching this on YouTube, hit the bell, subscribe, and let me know in the comments what your takeaway is today. Otherwise, we will see you next time on the Midlife Business Academy.
